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What A Tanker Campaign

Started by Gary Martin, June 03, 2018, 11:17:40 am

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martink0646

Hi Gary,

Really enjoyed it, thanks.  Looking at how our game panned out it played relatively historically. Gung-ho Russians advancing on the objectives with slightly more cautious Germans waiting & pushing onto the objectives on the final turn.

The bit that didn't quite fit for me was that the Germans historically used ambush tactics so as a thought, all German tanks must start in cover (hard?) & have restricted movement/no movement in the first two turns?

In hindsight, we (the Russians) could have sat back & waited & then rushed the objectives at the end but that would seem to be against the 'spirit' of the game?

Just a thought...I really enjoyed it as it was & winning or losing in a group like this hardly seems relevant to me as long as I have had fun interacting with my team mates, so I would be more than happy to continue as it is.  That might be heresy but I honestly don't care as long as I've thrown dice.

MartinK
28mm: Ready for Action - Home Guard, Brit Recon Force, US Army, US Marines, Battling Bastards of Bataan, early war French. 
28mm: In Build - 'The Eagle Has Landed' list, Brit Commandos, Captain America & the Howling Commandos
28mm: Wish List - Hungarian/Romanian army
Cruel Seas: British & German starter forces.
Wish List: Star Wars Legion box set

Andy Miller

October 03, 2018, 05:05:21 pm #76 Last Edit: October 03, 2018, 05:14:29 pm by Andy Miller
Want to run my RP past you to see if I've got it -
Tanks knocked out (4) = 4CP

Promotions = 3RP (initial, +1 for 1st three kills, +1 for kill and combat days)  Hauptscharfuhrer
Days in combat = 1RP (Bronze)
Bravery = 4RP (Iron cross 2nd class[with oak leaves], 2 lots of 2kills per game)
Total = 8RP

Is this about right?
or is it Promotions = 6RP (initial {1}, +2 for first three kills, +3 for kill and combat day bronze) ???
Andy
Judge Dredd (Judges/Cal 2k+pts, Ape gang), FoW (MidWar German armour 2k pts, MidWar Afrika Corps 2k pts, LateWar German 4k+pts), Bolt Action (German, US Infantry), OpSquad (Panzer Grenadiers, Falschirmjaeger, Brit Inf), Dux Brit (Saxons), WoW (a small airforce), Fantasy (High Elves, Brets), Dystopian (FSA), Uncharted seas (Iron Dwarves), Sails of glory, X-wing, Dreadball (Humans and Dwarves), Check your six. Star Wars Armada. ECW Parliamentarian army.

Carl Fisher

Looking at the results so far, and how the first game played, the fact that Russians tanks respawn easily, just improves the game for the Germans. Just becomes a turkey shoot.

Given that the T34s appear to be easier to kill, and given objectives and special rules that discourage the Russians from hanging back, it all looks to be a bit one sided.

Given the results of game two seems to still favour the Germans.
Games Played (Armies): WAB + WaC (IER Roman, Early Saxons and variants, Normans), WFB (Empire), 40K (Spacemarines), Uncharted Seas (Empire, Shroud Mages), WAB English Civil War (English!), Operation Squad (British) SAGA (Normans, Jomsvikings), Mordheim, Wings of War/Glory WWI, Dreadball, Chain of Command (British), Frostgrave, Sails of Glory and many others!!

Daniel Phillips

Across the 2 games the kill ratio is 14 to 1. Based on this I'd suggest changing the rules on when the Soviet players get vehicle upgrades from "The Soviets can upgrade at four kills to T34/85" to something based on taking objectives, surviving, gaining medals etc. Mixing in some T34/85s should even things up nicely (they are a lot better than T34s).
Warning: This post may contain sarcasm.
Current games & armies played- Gaslands: Idris. Full Thrust: NAC & NSL. Bolt Action: Late war German. Judge Dredd: Justice Dept & Renegade Robots. Kings of War: Dwarfs & Kingdoms of men. Mordheim: Skaven & Marianburg. Uncharted Seas: Iron Dwarfs. Necromunda: Orlock, Redemptionists & Van Saar. Direwolf Rampant : House Mallister.

Rob Farley

Quote from: Carl Fisher on October 03, 2018, 05:28:23 pm
Looking at the results so far, and how the first game played, the fact that Russians tanks respawn easily, just improves the game for the Germans. Just becomes a turkey shoot.

Given that the T34s appear to be easier to kill, and given objectives and special rules that discourage the Russians from hanging back, it all looks to be a bit one sided.

Given the results of game two seems to still favour the Germans.

All I can say is
Quote from: Rob Farley on September 20, 2018, 10:59:00 pm
All it will do is provide more T-34s for the Stugs to kill. It won't actually do anything to give the Russians a fighting chance.
Current games (and armies) played: Gaslands, Direwolf Rampant, Frostgrave, Bolt Action & Operation Squad (Desert Rats, Communist Chinese, Russians, partisans, Americans, Finns, Italian Paras), In Her Majesty's Name, Judge Dredd Miniatures, Dreadball, Deadzone, Mobile Frame Zero, Uncharted Seas (Orcs), Necromunda (Pit Slaves, Escher), Wings of War (WWI and WWII), Mordheim, Alien vs Predator, Warpath

Current Projects: Brotherhood Without Banners, Jomsvikings, the Blaine Legion, Gaslands vehicles, WWII Danish

Andy Miller

October 04, 2018, 10:32:27 am #80 Last Edit: October 09, 2018, 11:04:51 pm by Andy Miller
One question and one observation.
Q - "Contested objectives", is it still contested if one side has two tanks on the objective vs one from the opposition?
Observation - Agree with points made so far. Yes it is fun (but I've got a StuG). Prefer it not to be "same" sides, but still "fair". We could all downgrade to StuG F8's but that would have two more evenly matched sides. I think I'm trying to say I like the mismatch, but it should be fair to the Russians with some historically based fix. How did the Russian's win tank battles? Weight of numbers and drawing the German's into prepared defensive positions to name just two.
This does come back to the Russian's having extra tanks. I know Gary was trying to avoid this, but it might be worth trying as a fix, at least on one occasion/table? Expendable "Crazy Ivan" is in the spirit of things and as Grahame showed, although he was unlucky, did put the "cat among the pigeons".
As an alternate idea, random reinforcements come through with T34/85s. Either odd tanks here and there or one platoon (roll of a dice) gets the new ones?
As far as kills go, I can only speak for the ones on our table, mine have all been due to the advantage of flank shots (4+s hitting). One other player's kill due to wearing a T34 down to zero dice, fair enough!
Love the game and appreciate Martin's view on it, but I don't want to see the Russian's going AWOL and having issues with their commissar.
Andy
Judge Dredd (Judges/Cal 2k+pts, Ape gang), FoW (MidWar German armour 2k pts, MidWar Afrika Corps 2k pts, LateWar German 4k+pts), Bolt Action (German, US Infantry), OpSquad (Panzer Grenadiers, Falschirmjaeger, Brit Inf), Dux Brit (Saxons), WoW (a small airforce), Fantasy (High Elves, Brets), Dystopian (FSA), Uncharted seas (Iron Dwarves), Sails of glory, X-wing, Dreadball (Humans and Dwarves), Check your six. Star Wars Armada. ECW Parliamentarian army.

Gary Martin

October 05, 2018, 02:17:31 pm #81 Last Edit: October 28, 2018, 09:27:45 am by Gary Martin
Quote from: Andy Miller on October 03, 2018, 05:05:21 pm
Want to run my RP past you to see if I've got it -
Tanks knocked out (4) = 4CP

Promotions = 3RP (initial, +1 for 1st three kills, +1 for kill and combat days)  Hauptscharfuhrer
Days in combat = 1RP (Bronze)
Bravery = 4RP (Iron cross 2nd class[with oak leaves], 2 lots of 2kills per game)
Total = 8RP

Is this about right?
or is it Promotions = 6RP (initial {1}, +2 for first three kills, +3 for kill and combat day bronze) ???
Andy

Afraid not you are on 10 total . I think your the same as me but with 3 extra kills. You can only win the iron Cross 2nd class once, and be promoted to Obersharfuhrer once, all be it you did qualify for both twice. You would have won the IC 2nd class for your drive back to knockout Grahame, but you'd already qualified in kills, and not enough for a 1st class. Throat tin still away off
Gary Martin
'I do not fear an army of lions led by sheep, I fear an army of sheep led by a lion'. Alexander the Great

Figures: 28mm Imperial Roman and Ancient Britons 700 figures ish, 28mm Napoleonic French, Brits, Portugese and Dutch-Belgian, several thousand based for General de Brigade but work for most rules, 28mm WW2 German, Russian, British and US about company of each with vehicles 1 to 1. Large army's of 15mm Napoleonic most nations based to Napoleons Battles but fairly flexible.

Gary Martin

Warning Order:

Next Campaign day approaches. After the losses incurred by the 5th Guards, the Stavka has sent the latest available AFV, SU 85. Two of these have been issued to each Plt, 1 to each Plt Comdr and 1 other as per direction of the Plt Comdr. SU 85 has radio and so can communicate with other SU 85. If destroyed they return as SU 85.

This should even things. The SU 85 became available toward the end of 1943 and had the more powerful 85mm A/T Gun. It ceased production a few months later when the new T34/85 went into full production. In what a tanker terms each side has the exact same points. Germans will be on the attack. Plts as below, the rule that Soviets are never out numbered remains.

Soviet Guards Tank Platoon 1. 
Acting Plt Comdr - Grahame (SU 85)
Tank Comdr - Mike
Tank Comdr - Chris
Tank Comdr - Ash

Soviet Guards Tank Platoon 2
Plt Comdr - Martin (SU 85).   
Tank Comdr - Pippa
Tank Comdr - Carl
Tank Comdr - Rob

2nd Stug Battery LAH. (Stug IIIG)
231 - Gary
232 - Andy Miller
233 - Dan
234 - Tom

2nd Panzer Kompanie LAH (Pzr IVH)
231 - Shawn
232 - Dave
233 - Andy Mellor
234 - Kevin
Gary Martin
'I do not fear an army of lions led by sheep, I fear an army of sheep led by a lion'. Alexander the Great

Figures: 28mm Imperial Roman and Ancient Britons 700 figures ish, 28mm Napoleonic French, Brits, Portugese and Dutch-Belgian, several thousand based for General de Brigade but work for most rules, 28mm WW2 German, Russian, British and US about company of each with vehicles 1 to 1. Large army's of 15mm Napoleonic most nations based to Napoleons Battles but fairly flexible.

Gary Martin

December 05, 2018, 08:17:19 pm #83 Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 05:34:17 pm by Gary Martin
Campaign Day 15/12/43

So beefed up by new SU85 the Soviets decided to probe forward toward the German positions. Given a break in the weather LAH also concluded a test of Soviet defences was in order and both forces bumped into each other and a general engagement followed.

Outcome; German = 9 (Win, Dave to Ace + 5 knockouts) Soviet = 9 (win + 6 Knockouts)

Campaign Standing;

German = 39
Soviet  = 10

Character Standing;

All players who attended have 15 Dec 43 recorded in Paybooks as a day in combat. Rob, Dan, Carl & Mike are awarded the Bronze Days in Combat award and receive 1RP for second day in combat.

Carl and Pippa are awarded Star of Lenin 2nd Class for heroic actions on the field. Pippa for a dash to outflank and Carl for slavish regard to orders.

Martin now known as the cat, as he once again survives using another of his 9 lives. Grahame, Pippa, Mike and Chris are promoted to Snr Sgt (2RP)
Dave received the Iron Cross 1st Class for destroying 3 tanks. He is promoted to Hauptscharfuhrer and takes command over from Shawn. He qualifies as an Ace and upgrades to a Tiger 1 and receives a total of 10RP.
Tom, Gary each receive 1CP for destroying a Tank. Andy recieves the Iron cross 1st class for valiantly holding the right flank against overwhelming odds the whole game. 3RP.
Grahame recieves 2CP for 2 tanks destroyed.
Pippa, Mike, Chris and Martin both receive 1CP for destroying a Tank.


Tank Score Total
Andy Miller on 4
Dave on 6
Tom on 3
Gary, Grahame & Martin on 2
Pippa, mike and Chris 1
Remainder on 0

To complex to work out all the character total RP. To work yours out mine is:
Tanks Knocked out = 2CP
Promotions = 3RP (Initial + to Oberscharfuhrer)
Days in Combat = 1RP (Bronze)
Bravery = 2RP (Iron Cross 2nd Class)
Total = 8

For Monday can I ask that each player completes the character sheet at annex A and hand to me. I need to check where everyone is. If I have missed anything let me know.
Gary Martin
'I do not fear an army of lions led by sheep, I fear an army of sheep led by a lion'. Alexander the Great

Figures: 28mm Imperial Roman and Ancient Britons 700 figures ish, 28mm Napoleonic French, Brits, Portugese and Dutch-Belgian, several thousand based for General de Brigade but work for most rules, 28mm WW2 German, Russian, British and US about company of each with vehicles 1 to 1. Large army's of 15mm Napoleonic most nations based to Napoleons Battles but fairly flexible.

Gary Martin

February 04, 2019, 11:40:47 am #84 Last Edit: February 04, 2019, 12:08:36 pm by Gary Martin
Apologies for the late delay in results from last game.

So as the LAH launched its attack they were met by a rejuvenated and reinforced Soviet Army. As worn out Pzr IV's and Stug's desperately tried to hold, their exhausted crews were driven back on both fronts. Even the intervention of the first tiger failed to hold the red horde onslaught, and was forced to retreat to its start lines.

Outcome; German = 6 (Andy to Ace + 5 knockouts) Soviet = 15 (2 wins, bonus + 6 Knockouts)

Campaign Standing;

German = 45
Soviet  = 23

Character Standing;

24/12/43 is entered as a day in combat. All who have 4 days in combat are awarded the silver award and receive 2RP.
Andy destroyed a T34 (Carl) and reached Panzer Ace and upgrades to Tiger.  He recieves a commission and is promoted to Untersturmfuhrer and becomes Plt Cdr (5 Kills, Silver award). Dave is also promoted to Untersturmfuhrer and becomes Plt Cdr (8 Kills, silver award). Gary promoted to Hauptsharfuhrer (2 kills and silver). Dave and Gary recieves Iron Cross 1st class due to heroic acts.
Grahame upgrades to T34/85 and is promoted to Sgt Major and Plt Cdr. Martin also is promoted to Sgt Major (Silver, 2 kills). Pippa, Mike and Chris recieves the Star of Lenin Class 1 for heroic acts and destroying Tiger. Pippa and Chris also promoted to Sgt Major (Silver, 2 kills)

Tank Score Total
Andy Miller on 5
Dave on 8
Tom on 4
Grahame on 3
Gary, Mike, Chris, Pippa & Martin on 2
Mike, Dan and Ash on 1
Remainder on 0

So they are the main points from the last game. If I have got any thing wrong let me know. You all need to update your characters sheets as I haven't seen them. As an example mine is updated as follows;
Tanks Knocked out = 2CP
Promotions = 6RP (Initial + to Oberscharfuhrer + Hauptsharfuhrer)
Days in Combat = 3RP (Bronze + Silver)
Bravery = 6RP (Iron Cross 1st & 2nd Class)
Total = 17
       
Gary Martin
'I do not fear an army of lions led by sheep, I fear an army of sheep led by a lion'. Alexander the Great

Figures: 28mm Imperial Roman and Ancient Britons 700 figures ish, 28mm Napoleonic French, Brits, Portugese and Dutch-Belgian, several thousand based for General de Brigade but work for most rules, 28mm WW2 German, Russian, British and US about company of each with vehicles 1 to 1. Large army's of 15mm Napoleonic most nations based to Napoleons Battles but fairly flexible.

Gary Martin

Warning Order:

Next Campaign day approaches. After pushing back the LAH to its start lines 5Th Guards tank Army decides to launch a full attack with the first of the new T34/85's appearing. LAH can only hope that the new tigers will enable them to hold. Soviets are attacking so have to turn a dice to a 1 and move forward. STah, STah.....

Soviet Guards Tank Platoon 1. 
Plt Comdr - Grahame (T34/85)
Tank Comdr - Mike (SU 85)
Tank Comdr - Chris
Tank Comdr - Ash

Soviet Guards Tank Platoon 2
Plt Comdr - Martin (SU 85).   
Tank Comdr - Pippa (SU 85)
Tank Comdr - Carl
Tank Comdr - Rob

2nd Stug Battery LAH. (Stug IIIG)
231 - Andy Miller Tiger
232 - Gary
233 - Dan
234 - Tom

2nd Panzer Kompanie LAH (Pzr IVH)
231 - Dave - Tiger
232 - Shawn
233 - Andy Mellor
234 - Kevin
Gary Martin
'I do not fear an army of lions led by sheep, I fear an army of sheep led by a lion'. Alexander the Great

Figures: 28mm Imperial Roman and Ancient Britons 700 figures ish, 28mm Napoleonic French, Brits, Portugese and Dutch-Belgian, several thousand based for General de Brigade but work for most rules, 28mm WW2 German, Russian, British and US about company of each with vehicles 1 to 1. Large army's of 15mm Napoleonic most nations based to Napoleons Battles but fairly flexible.

Mike Whitaker

There appear to be two of me in the points tally, one on one, one on two
Blog: http://troubleatthemill.blogspot.com/
Games (currently) Played: IABSM, Dux Britanniarum, Sails of Glory, Gaslands, What A Tanker!, SW: Armada
28mm: Parthians, Early Imperial Roman, British Tribes, Saxons, Norman/Christian Spanish, English Civil War Royalists; WW2 Wehrmacht, Red Devils, Home Guard; Judge Dredd Judges, Dreadball Void Sirens. GoT Night's Watch
15mm: WW2 US, British/Canadian and Heer infantry companies + support
54mm: HYW French and British
1/1000: Sails of Glory (lots)
WIP: 28mm WW2 British Commandos; 28mm War of the Roses, KoW Elves, Peninsular British/French/Spanish; 28mm Coalition Wars SF; 15mm Fallschirmjaeger and US Paras, lots of 15mm WW2 vehicles. 1/2400 WW2 Naval

This sig is a GW- and Flames of War-free (except for the figures I own!) zone.

Shawn Comer

I just calculated my RP, and I believe I should have a total of 8 RP.
Kills = 2 (2 RP)
Promotion to Untersharfuhrer (1 RP) and promotion to Obersharfuhrer (2 RP)
3x scenarios = Bronze Badge (1 RP)
Iron Cross 2nd Class (2 RP)

Is this correct?